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Is Penguin Released

sonic81sonic81
in Need Help
Hey guys,

Is anyone seeing a ridiculous movement in serps?  I'm seeing some wierd jumps I'm wondering if there has been a release I just see1 thread on warrior forum saying similar things but that's it.
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  • sonic81sonic81
    http://trafficplanet.com/topic/6369-penguin-20-now-live/
  • sonic81sonic81
    Post on traffic planet.

    Would be interesting to see if people's experiences match my own so far i've seen rankings across the board drop on sites i've used GSA SER.  Obviously lots of variables and too early to tell but my rankings haven't been smashed i.e. movements from 1st page to 2nd page.  havne't seen big drops (100+) except for 1-2 websites.

    my gut feel early on is it's link devaluation not penalties (like tripping penguin #1 anchor text % filter).  if that is the case then it's recoverable.  thoughts from others?


    Posted 20 May 2013 - 21:09

    vkhare, on 20 May 2013 - 20:38, said:image

    I think it's already happening.  Was working with a friend who had 2 of his sites hammered.   Both of them had a penalty applied to the domain and all his rankings dropped 50 or 100 spots in the SERPs.

     

    It was on May 15th.  

     

    So I went through what he had done differently on those sites and on two of his link building campaigns he had GSA SER set to build 'exploit' links at his money site.  That lines up with Matt's video about them being more aggressive about hacked link placements.

     

    Checking the 'exploit' option was obviously an oversight on his part.

     

    Might try the disavow link tool to see if it that can help him recover.

     

    Yes but I dont think it has even started yet personally as if first proper penguin was anything to by there were lots of people posting about how they had been slapped on this forum and also every forum and at the moment everything seems a bit too quiet IMO

  • sonic81sonic81
    Another good post on traffic planet (see below).  I've highlighted the good parts

    Matches my experience.  Looks like spam links like ones generated by GSA have been devalued more in this update, hence relative ranking drop.

    -----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    Yes the update has been rolled out. My first observations are this:
     
    - Links from seo tools have been devalued. I think they have targeted SEnuke and other similar tools.
    - Links from social bookmarks, wikis and article directories are devalued.
    - Good web 2.0 links retain their value (Subdomains only imo). Although some may have been manually devalued by Google Nazi's.
    - Good relevant paid links retain their value.
    - I also think there is some form of new content analysis that devalues links. Although i am not sure yet.
    - Domain relevancy is becoming more important imo.
     
    By proxy this obviously increases the value of other metrics. Nothing is surprising with this update at all, and it just echoes the general direction Google is heading and the objectives they are trying to achieve. Old sites, brands and authorities seem to outrank sites that have "done seo".
     
    This has nothing to do with site metrics. But because spam links are becoming less important, site metrics, brand metrics, social metrics and other metrics are all becoming more important in comparisson.
     
    That being said, i have seen "smart" mass spam dominate. Lots of new sites with mass spam are ranking even higher as "less smart" sites are clipped by this penalty.
     
    I will write a full report on this when the dust settles. 
     
    FYI i have been monitoring my niche like a hawk. So i am seeing which sites rise and which sites fall. In the next 24-48 hours i will write a blog post  and tell you exactly what has been effected.
     
    Overall search quality is no better, so this is just an attack on SEO's to increase Googles bottom line.


  • system0102system0102
    I see movements. Positive ones  :D
  • sonic81sonic81
    Good stuff! :)  You never know what happens when google releases an algorithm update good to see someone comes out on top.
  • babababa
    mine one site drooped from 2 to 16
    and one up from 45 to 15
  • sonic81sonic81
    i see similar i was #2 and #3 dropped to 15 and 25.  guessing its link devaluation of GSA / Xrumer style links 
  • ronron SERLists.com

    Possibly, but it could be other factors like the newness (lack of age) of the links, etc.

    The lifetime of a website just keeps getting shorter and shorter if you are just in it for the quick buck. Mainly because various updates will eventually catch up to them. So if that's you're game (which applies to most of us), I think it's important to have a regular production line of sites. Some will get whacked, others replace them, and the cycle repeats. The advice is don't get emotional about their demise. It's all part of the grand plan. Detroit comes out with completely new cars every 2-3 years because they know models die - it's called planned obsolescence.

    If you're more serious about the life cycle of your websites, then SEO involves more than just using a single linkbuilding product, and then call it a day. There are so many different choices we have at our disposal. It's just smart to take a more thorough approach if you really want to make a living out here.

    Overall, this was a slap in the face, but not a beheading like Penguin 1. Most of us learned some big lessons. I think we'll all survive.

  • dogGooglesdogGoogles
    @Ron . . . what kind of changes have you seen in your SER back-linked sites?
  • ronron SERLists.com

    I have a number, but about half stayed the same. On the ones affected, the main terms only went down a few spots. Secondary terms went down a lot. Some inner pages went down a lot. So it will have some effect, but not catastrophic.

    The good news: It's summer! Traffic goes down naturally in the summer because everybody is out playing. So now's the time to start some new sites and get them ready for post-summer.

     

  • sonic81sonic81
    Agree on the life cycle of websites.  I think it's equally important to diagnose what went wrong and what tripped up the ranking drops albeit even small ones so this can be corrected for future linkbuilding efforts.

    For example on my quick glances I can see one of my main money making websites was untouched, on has dropped a few ranks on first page, one has dropped to second page.

    Another one disappeared from google's serps for 1 keyword (but fine for others).  I have used simliar link building patterns for each of these websites so I'm spending today trying to diagnose and see if there was anything in particular different.
  • VelocityVelocity
    edited May 2013
    hmm, I had quite a few get smacked. At first glance I cannot see why some got hit and others did not. Funnily enough my spam project is alive and well (just built as many links as I could of every type!) and sitting on page 1, it actually moved up a couple of spots.

    @sonic81 I am also going to have a good look and see if I can spot anything today. Be interesting to share our results.

    I have noticed that my domains that got hit have moved all over the place. During the last penguin the penalties I got smacked my sites out of the top100 whereas this one has moved results in a more random fashion. One KW went from 3 to 16. This leads me to believe it is not so much of a -100 or -500, but, more of a reduction on link juice or PR.

    Let's see what others have to say over the next few days....
  • AlexRAlexR Cape Town
    Talking of penalties, what would you guys rate as the top 5 Google filters that get applied that cause a penalty? e.g.
    1) Link diversity
    2) Anchor text diversity
    3)..etc.etc

    AND more importantly what do you think the filter that is getting applied by Penguin2.0? I've read such drivel about it...
  • sonic81sonic81
    I think Penguin 2 is different to Penguin 1.  I think it's just link devaluing so far I don't think there have been any filters that penalize like over optimised anchor text like in penguin #1.

    this is not a very educated guess from me as i'm only observing my own sites i haven't been smashed out of the park like penguin 1 in this update i.e. i think it's devaluing rather than over optimization filters (which would smash the rankings to like -100 or more).
  • sonic81sonic81
    also early observations video is not hit youtube seems to be very trusted and i haven't seen any ranking drops in video.  so far...
  • VelocityVelocity
    Couple of things from the comments on Cutts blog that he responded to.

    This was not run on full power, they can adjust the impact in the future. (I guess they started out small to measure the results before they blow up the internet!).

    This did not include the "upstream link devaluation" that was mentioned in the recent "whats coming this summer" video, that is coming later.
  • ben_georgeben_george
    I have had three sites hit, one losing about 10 positions for most keywords, others dropping several pages.

    as ron says, always keep a conveyor belt of new sites coming, dont stop.

    try different things with each one, try and learn what works.
  • davbeldavbel UK
    @Sonic81 Youtube will always be safe.  Google will never devalue their own properties :D
  • klaus007klaus007
    same here like @ron :
    25 % sites + main keys vanished
    there rest: the subpages and innerpages lost much rankings, dropped down badly!

    conclusion same as ron: build up more sites, dont think about what works; -> white hat sites lost rankings, black hat site lost rankings, GSA, Senuke, SAPE, blognetworks, etc. all dropped down or went up! so, its everytime not easy to find the right reason
    conclusion: build more sites and understand, that this is the part of the game! =)

  • jiggsawjiggsaw
    I don't believe in any of this link devaluation b.s. Like I said in another thread.... every single one of my sites are up. And I'm talking about top 3 spots for keywords. They all use tiers as well as massive spam. The content isn't even 100% unique. However, I don't use any of the "blueprints" that people post online. Link diversity + anchor text diversity = Win. Google is full of shit imo. I don't even believe in this "upstream link devaluation" that they claim is coming later this summer. They're just trying to get people to stop doing what works. 
  • spunko2010spunko2010 Isle of Man
    @Jiggsaw when you say link diversity do you mean variable sources eg microblog, wikis, articles, all sorts?

    If you can post how this relates to GSA it might help others, or at least me :)
  • jiggsawjiggsaw
    @spunko2010 Yes, that's what I'm saying. Links coming from different platforms and different ip's throughout the world. :)

  • eLeSlasheLeSlash
    @Jiggsaw im allmost sure that you didnt blasted your moneysite with wikis, social bookmarks, social networks. How is the tier 1 looking for you? Web 2.0 only right? and blast everything to those web 2.0. That is why your website didnt lose rankings i think. Let us know.
  • sonic81sonic81
    saw this on traffic planet:

    this is inline for the portion of my sites that were hit.  1 pagers that i got on page #1 using some aggressive link spam techniques.

    for the guys that got hit i.e. droppings say 20 rankings was it similar most links going to 1 page?

    Posted Today, 23:10

    I'm seeing an interesting trend of all the sites I'm tracking (66). The only ones that were hit significantly (more than 10+ positions), all had one thing in common: Over 94% of the links to the site were to a single page. Nothing scientific about it, but interesting nonetheless.


  • jiggsawjiggsaw
    @eLeSlash No, my Tier 1 does not consist of only web 2.0's. Yes, I hit my moneysite with all kinds of links. However, I wouldn't say that I'm "blasting" it. 

    Web 2.0 only and blasting everything to those web 2.0's? Umm... no. That's what EVERYONE is doing on every forum. I don't follow the crowd.
  • spunko2010spunko2010 Isle of Man
    edited May 2013
    jiggsaw, so you aren't blasting your MS  with only web 2.0s, so what then? care to share what link types?
  • dogGooglesdogGoogles
    I kind of like what @jiggsaw is suggesting here.  It does seem more natural.  Although the method @ron uses  https://forum.gsa-online.de/discussion/2930/ser-tiers/p1 has a lot of benefits as well.  Not the least of which being only spending your SER resources backlinking contextual tiers (better at passing link juice, and more natural).  Throw into the mix the success @insane has had with his utter-spammed sites, and it occurred to me, that it might make sense to tweak rons approach a bit.  That being, where you use his tiered approach, but add one more kitchenSink box that points directly at your money site, and only trickles links at say 5 submissions per day indefinitely.  Of course, I wouldn't bother backlinking these additional links.
  • jiggsawjiggsaw
    edited May 2013
    Exactly what @dogGoogles said. Ron's method is excellent but that shouldn't be the only thing you're doing. You need to build on that or else you're setting yourself up for failure imo. So yes I use blog comments, yes I use guestbooks, yes I use forum profiles, etc. I just don't go crazy with it and "blast" like a lot of people say. Like I said, think like a big brand ex: Wal-Mart. How many contextual type links on different social networks like dolphin and phpfox do you really think is in their backlink profile? Or even on Web 2.0's like tumblr, jigsy, blog.co.uk? I do use them though. I just don't think those are the "only" type of links you should use for Tier 1. I hope that answers your question @spunko2010
  • ronron SERLists.com
    edited May 2013

    This was from above that @sonic81 saw on another forum:

    I'm seeing an interesting trend of all the sites I'm tracking (66). The only ones that were hit significantly (more than 10+ positions), all had one thing in common: Over 94% of the links to the site were to a single page. Nothing scientific about it, but interesting nonetheless.

    This may be that guy's observation from that niche (probably payday loans) where everybody is trying to get somebody to click something one page 1.

    But I can tell for a fact that inner pages on multi-page sites took a big hit. In fact, I think it was for the opposite reason: too many links on inner pages.

    Also, the fact that 'other' anchors were hit hard (as opposed to the main anchor for the homepage) tells me something too. As if they were expecting that people would do that after penguin 1.

     

  • scorpioscorpio
    @ron :  Ssshhhhhh................
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