Let me appologize for that block of text above. Apparently when you type out replies on an Ipad the paragraph breaks don't post
Now to answer your questions awint, I need to first point out a few things...
Many people on this forum have used both Ozz'es Guide and Ron's Guide with much success! So we know tiered link building works. In addition, we know 'Tiered Content' link building works.
Both of theses guides are based on my principle of content tier'ing as layed out in This Post and This Post. Ozz'es guide gives my posts direct credit, while Ron's guide barrows from Ozz'es guide which inherently means that the concept is borrowed directly from my concepts.
So what we know: - More links are better than fewer links for competitive niche's - Content Tiering works - Indexing is a critical component of link building - Rank WYZ can run thousands of WEB 2.0 blogs, in tiers!
Additionally: - 1st generation posters are ineffective at running blog networks of any considerable scale. - 1st gen posters were designed to fill 30-60 blogs with content, not thousands. - 1st gen posters need to be constantly monitored for posting and aren't completely automated.
For Reference 1st Generation Posters Are: Senuke, Magic Submitter, SEO Link Robot, SERobot, etc. 2nd Generation Posters Are: Link Wheel Bandit, FCS Networker, RankWYZ
The difference between the posters is volume and automation. The scale of use in the 2nd generation of posters simply can't be matched by their 1st generation counterparts.
Why Is This Important?
When you look at my posts, you will find that running tier's is mostly about scaling operations. The larger the scale of the operation, the more successful the linking campaign will be. We could stop right there and confirm RankWYZ as the best tool for that since it can operate on the largest scale out of all of the tools considered, but let's look at some examples.
While any poster can create just a few tier's of links, not all posters can leverage the power of large networks of tiered links. The above image represents what RankWYZ can do, but also what SENuke and other first generation posters can do.
With RankWYZ you can run much larger, more powerful networks which making your link building efforts much more meaningful and gives your work much greater impact on the actual SERPS.
Besides Basic Link Building
Once you have many networks of several hundred blogs you can also build one specific network of blogs purely meant to do other things - such as indexing your backlinks.
While tools like RankWYZ and GSa are both great, they are only as effective as their indexed backlinks....
An easy way to solve this problem is to maintain a network of regularly crawled web 2.0's and post links to the links you need to get index from it.
In other words, RankWYZ gives you a completely automated indexing machine as well as a link building web 2.0 based network.
Hopefully I've illustrated why the second generation of posters are much more powerful than their first generation counterparts. RankWYZ is one of several of the second generation, but having used both link wheel bandit and FCS networker - it's a hands down win for RankWYZ because of how easily you can scale your operation from not just hundreds of blogs, but up to thousands of blogs with RankWYZ.
*I'm not paid to make these statements, and I've been involved in BH SEO for years. My opinions are based on my experience with all of the tools listed and their practical application and limits as the developers have designed them.*
I butchered the grammar in that post... but it was in the morning, so... I'm embarrassed but not horribly so.
Anyways, I'm glad that you enjoyed it.
I think RankWYZ has a lot of potential and I plan on pushing it to the max with it. So far the results have been extremely promising and it's effectively using a strategy I've been a fan of for years.
Best yet, they have a GSA tool so you can download links right into GSA and fire more links at the networks!
Thanks GOY for great and clear explanation, it seem you are partner or rankwyz.:-) kidding.
Don't you think rankwyz is too expensive? what is cost to buy pre-made blogs?
With 410$ monthly and the cost you buy blog account, you still have limit on daily posts, that is 5,000. Don't you think it is very small number, we usually blast with 10 or 100 times more links. so how can it is nearly unlimited? how can help index so many links?
but with FCS and LWB, you can run unlimited indeed. there is only machine/server limit.
I have not use rankwyz so ONLY I can guess is Rankwyz can do huge scale with a very easy way that mean COMPLETELY automatically, but with much more cost. Am I right?
What is drop rate when you use Rankwyz. It is very important. With LWB there is a auto heal. with FCS, you can "heal" manually for free. but can Rankwyz compensate blogs account for free if got deleted or you must will buy again? if stick rate is high, that is not important.
Thanks GOY for great and clear explanation, it seem you are partner or rankwyz.:-) kidding.
- LOL, no not a partner. But I am a happy user, so when I read this thread I felt compelled to correct a lot of the bad information and misunderstanding in it. When you release your tool, if I use it and think highly of it, I'd probably do the same for it if people bashed it over silly things, like 5000 posts per day. I'll explain why I think that is pretty silly...
With 410$ monthly and the cost you buy blog account, you still have limit on daily posts, that is 5,000. Don't you think it is very small number, we usually blast with 10 or 100 times more links. so how can it is nearly unlimited? how can help index so many links?
- Have you ever run a large blog network on satellite properties before? Maybe not with WEB 2.0, but something like WPMU or anything like that?
If you haven't, then let me explain a few things...
You can't post to each one every day. If you do, they will be quickly banned and lost. When they get banned, all of the links that you've build to them are worthless. So basically, if you think you need to post once or '100's' of times each day to each blog then you are going to be wasting a lot of time.
You will be wasting time not just building the blogs, but building links to the blogs. >>> Because of that you DO NOT want to post every day to every blog <<< Now that's different than the gen 1 posters because they weren't built to run networks, they were built to post articles.
I don't think you understand the difference between a web 2.0's tool
that just posts articles and a web 2.0 tool that runs networks. It's a big difference!
When you are just posting articles, then it makes sense to post to those accounts as often as possible because it doesn't matter if they get banned. When you are running a network, you want to avoid the accounts from getting banned. That goes for LWB, FCS, or RankWYZ.
To be honest, you aren't alone. When I read the replies that were above this, it was clear that most newbs didn't see the difference between running a network and just posting some articles.
-=- If you don't want to run a network or don't understand why you would want to run a network then FCS, LWB and RankWYZ really aren't for you. -=-
At most your blogs shouldn't be posted to more than 2-3 times a week! So if you are posting to yoru blgos 2-3 times a week, let's say it's once every 3 days.
- There's 30 days in a month, that's 10 posts per month you will want to be making per blog. - You can post 5000 times per day on my account, so that's 150,000 posts per month that you can make.
150,000 posts divided by 10 posts per blog = *15,000 Blogs You Can Run!*
So no, I think $400 a month is a fair price to run 15,000 web 2.0 accounts a month. If you don't think you can build any links from 15,000 blog accounts every month then I think you are in the wrong business
So, how do you index links with 'Just' 5000 posts a day? That's also really silly to suggest you can't.
There's no rule saying that you can put 20 links into an post. It's actually very common practice with a lot of these 'Index services.'
So, 20 links x 5000 posts a day = 100,000 links per day that you could be trying to get indexed.
- When you look at the math, are you beginning to see why it's silly of you to think that 5000 posts per day is a limiting factor?
but with FCS and LWB, you can run unlimited indeed. there is only machine/server limit. You are wrong here.
- With FCS it's 15,000 to 30,000 a month - NOT a 'machine limit.'
- With LWB, have you ever used it? It's not a machine limit - you are limited by the number of times it crashes. It constantly needed to be restarted, but all that time that it was hun up - it wasn't posting!
So on that point you are completely inaccurate.
I have not use rankwyz so ONLY I can guess is Rankwyz can do huge scale
with a very easy way that mean COMPLETELY automatically, but with much
more cost. Am I right?
If you haven't used it then why are you making assumptions? Just saying, you are pretty much slamming the hell out of something you've never used...
And $98 a month for a more 'affordable' plan is still much cheaper than $147 a month for SENuke. The difference is that you will still be able to run far more blogs on the $98 plan than you could with all 3 installs of SENuke.
So here again, you are incorrect in your assumption on price to performance.
What is drop rate when you use Rankwyz. It is very important. With LWB
there is a auto heal. with FCS, you can "heal" manually for free. but
can Rankwyz compensate blogs account for free if got deleted or you
must will buy again? if stick rate is high, that is not important.
Above we talked about not posting to the blogs too frequently. That helps with the stick rate incredibly.
Using my posting strategy, I've only lost about 30 blogs out of 1000. That's 3%. But that's my case. I'd say 10% is more reasonable, and anything above 10% is too high.
If you lose blogs, you do have to either create them yourself, or buy them - BUT - once a month you get a bunch of free blogs depending on which plan you are on. The $98 plan gives you 80 free blogs a month if I recall correctly, so more than enough to replace the banned blogs.
Well, it should be more than enough... if you post with it like it wasn't meant to run a network, then you might need more but really that your own user error, not the fault of the system.
As far as LWB's auto heal system, we know you haven't used RankWYZ but have you used LWB? The auto-heal virtually never worked as planned. It was hung up, crash, etc and not 'fix links' in posts already on the other blogs.
In addition, LWB only actually support 15-20 properties, while RankWYZ currently supports over 100.
With RankWYZ, you are notified in your user panel when blogs are suspended and it literally takes less than 60 seconds to replace them with new blogs.
So In Conclusion -
There's some misunderstandingsyou had about RankWYZ. Hopefully we got those corrected.
RankWYZ isn't the perfect tool but it is much better than most other tools on the market and it's one I believe in.
-=-=- But In order to get any value out of it you have to understand the difference between an article poster and a blog network -=-=-
Have you ever run a large blog network on satellite properties before?
Yes, I run blog network with domain before.
It cost me too much money. If rankwyz can do something like a private network, 410$ is not expensive. but as I know, content is key to a private network. you need to find a way to get tons of unique and readable content, that is why you buy scanner to scan book. right. for submission, there are tons of tool that can update private network like WP.
If rankwyz only do submit, and not offer quality content, 410$ still expensive, Think this way, hire a staff exclusive reboot LWB or operate and monitor some tool that are not automatical. human with a Not-automatical-submitter will defeat rankwyz with even lower cost and more feature:-)
If FCS have limit too, let 's ignore it. But with senuke and MS, you still can do this trick, let staff run the tools and create much much more blogs account than rankwyz and post any number article you want if it is safe to built a network.
You have total control and lower cost than Rankwyz.
More, Rankwyz are not complete automatically, because you need to buy accounts, scrape quality content, monitor if blog suspended. You still need to manage a staff to do for you.
and I only do private network with my self domain, why? web2.0 keep delete your account, I heard of some half-year blogs been deleted and they do not any un-normal thing. maybe it is inaccurate to estimate, maybe you still get decent blogs survived after one year.
That is purely just ROI, with 4100$ yearly, what you get? worth it? ANY CHEAPER WAY?
How much money to buy blogs account in rankwyz? it is another cost.
There's no rule saying that you can put 20 links into an post. It's actually very common practice with a lot of these 'Index services.'
Yes, but you dare to put 20 links on a post on web2.0? They may delete your accout like crazy man. it is totall spam no doubt. and it is easy to detected and reported. it just my experience, maybe you can bypass it with some trick.
I look forward to your tool awint
I do not know LWB are so buggy. I heard of can bypass the bugs with some trick.
Thanks for your interested, my tool will alternatively to rankwyz but with much less cost. Maybe better to raise price of my tool, it seem it worth more money.
So basic, you prefer a private network management tool but on web2.0 property not on self-domain.
I do not know how many seos like what are rankwyz good at.
Is it possible for you by any chance to affillate my tool if you like it and it do better than rankwyz? I can make customized version for you.
Okay, let's talk about LWB bandit more in depth and compare the two - since you seem to think it's the holy grail...
By the way, you seem to want to argue that it is like RankWYZ or superior to it, but you've never used it?
I on the other hand used it for over a year!
But okay, you're asking for it
Link schemes -
With LWB you are STUCK in their linking scheme. You have no control over it. You get anything from 1x0x0 to 10x10x10 but that's it.
With RankWYZ you can run blog networks any way you want. You can run them 10x50x100, or 10x1000, or even 5x20x50x75x100x200x400x1000 if you wanted to. There's no limit with RankWYZ, you aren't locked into their pre-defined system.
LWB simply doesn't offer you that level of flexibility.
So yes, you can hire someone for hundreds of dollars a month to run your content and LWB installs, but in the end you are still only working for 15-20 sites vs. the 100+ sites of RankWYZ.
And on top of it, with RankWYZ you choose exactly what sites you want to use...
- Let's Go Back Over That -
LWB does NOT let you have complete control of how your network is built.
RankWYZ gives you complete freedom in not only how it is built
LWB locks you into using 15-20 sites they want you to use.
RankWYZ let's your CHOOSE from over 100 sites!
Win = RankWYZ
==========================
Content System
With link wheel bandit you have to give it every article it posts. You have to make/generate them, insert your own images, your own videos, links if you want to, et... But YOU have to waste time to do it.
With RankWYZ, you can use scraped and combined content, you have News Aggregation, you can use RSS feeds, you can use your own articles, etc...
On top of it RankWYZ will scrape and insert images for you, it will scrape and inserts video's for you, and it will inject links for you.
But even better, since some images you scrape may be huge (like 1200 pixels wide) - you can also format the maximum image width so that the articles it posts actually look decent!
So let's go over this.
LWB Doesn't Scrape & Inject Images
RankWYZ Does Scrape & Inject Images
* RankWYZ can also Format the Image Widths*
LWB Doesn't Scrape & Inject Videos
RankWYZ Does Scrape & Injects Videos
* RankWYZ also lets you select position of the videos*
LWB Doesn't Offer New Aggregation
RankWYZ Does Offer News Aggregation
*You select how long the snippets are and how many to use*
LWB Doesn't Offer Posting From RSS Feeds
RankWYZ Does Offer Posting From RSS Feeds
LWB Doesn't Scrape & Combine Mashed Content For You
RankWYZ Does Scrape & Combine Mashed Content For You
Win = RankWYZ by a lot!
=====================
User Experience
As already covered LWB crashes all the time, and needs constant babysitting. When you look at the LACK OF FEATURES above, isn't it pretty sad that it needs you to watch it all the time?
By comparison, RankWYZ is completely automated. You never need to worry about whats going on. It's always going to be posting without you logging into servers, updating things, closing and reopening it, rebooting servers, etc.
On top of the month cost of LWB, you will also need to rent a server, which can be another $75-$200 a month on top of the payment for using LWB.
RankWYZ runs on someone else's servers that you don't pay for, you never need to worry about logging into, etc.
So to cover:
LWB Needs Constant Babysitting And Your Full Time Attention
RankWYZ Is Completely Automatic
LWB Requires You To use Your Own Hardware
RankWYZ Uses Their Hardware, That You Never Have To Monitor
LWB Ties You Up Monitoring You Own Hardware
RankWYZ Is Automatic, You Never Need To Check Their Servers
Are you starting to see a trend?
LWB may be cheaper, but it's not even half the tool that RankWYZ is.
I'm not sure why you want to talk badly about RankWYZ when LWB is such a piece of shit by comparison
And do the math....
Link Wheel Bandit =
$57.50 Per Month + $75-$200 A Month For A Server + Labor To Pay Someone To Babysit it, reboot it, etc.
RankWYZ =
$28 - $418 a month, all inclusive. You can upgrade your plan as your needs increase and further more, the content actually posted has many more features automatically inserted.
So, what kind of value is LWB by comparison again? LOL...
Case closed on LWB.
***Important Little Update***
If the rumor is true, it appears that Pavel will be releasing a desktop account creator so that you no longer have to buy accounts - you'll be able to create your own, for free (minus captcha costs of course).
So... that just stopped being a problem with RankWYZ
I am with GOY, RankWyz is a beast. I also have a FCS lifetime license to combine the power of the two tools: I do not want to spend 400$ per month as GOY does so I import/export 500 blogs (RW MasterWizard plan) from RW to FCS when I need to post more content on new blogs through RW. Pretty handy. I am wondering the next movements from both RW and FCS: as GOY states, social bookmarking will be a crucial battle. I am waiting for it.
@GODOVERYOU - thanks for the detailed explanation.
I wanted to ask the following:
1) If we use Jameses service where he is building over 30 maintained properties.
2) If GSA SER adds the following:
a) Allows posting of articles without links.
b) Allows reposting of articles based on a random schedule. I.e. (I was thinking of 1-2 posts per week to each platform (randomise the timing of these posts) )
3) Build tiers below these maintained properties.
(regarding content for these plaftorms you could use another tool to import the .txt into a folder and use a macro in SER to grab a random piece of content - so this handles the content side of things.
Surely this would be quite effective? Maybe not the whole 108 properties of rankwyz but it would do a decent job of it. Or is there something else that Rankwyz offers that SER can't do?
also remember that not all of rankwyz Web20s are indexable (or just after a while) if i'm not wrong. Jamese swapped some Web20s because of this in the recent weeks (again, if i'm not wrong).
i'm sure that the article management feature will come sooner or later. the question is how it looks like and how we can make use of it.
there will be also need of those high PR social bookmarking engines and i think that some document sharing sites couldn't hurt also.
- I don't want to say things that come across as bashing a product sold on these forums. -
I've got respect for anyone that mods GSA and sells GSA mods. So, anything I say will be with great respect for that product and it's developer.
That having been said, GSA operates as a first generation article post and not a second generation network builder.
So, you've got to wrap your head around a network builder concept vs a poster concept. They operate completely differently.
I suppose to quickly point out some differences:
The service works with ~30 sites while RankWYZ works with 100+.
The service (probably) doesn't scrape and combine content, images, videos, insert links from 5 different link sets, etc. RankWYZ does all of that.
Does the service let you interlink blogs? RankWYZ lets you interlink your network or networks to create random pattern tiers if you wanted to.
Mind you, I am saying that the service Jameses sells definitely took a lot of work and probably continues to take a lot of work to support. I respect that, and in no way will talk down about it.
But at the end of the day, it's a poster and not a network builder.
This is a really 'light' covering of the topic AlexR but I don't want to be the guy that potentially hurts a GSA SER developer, so I'm not going to dig into it and get into details like I did with LWB. There's just no need to do it, and I personally am not comfortable doing it as you can probably tell.
I would say that you should probably stick with Jameses service until the point in time that you actually need a more aggressive network builder like RankWYZ of FCS Networker.
@ Jameses, I hope I didn't offend you. I respect your work and would never have taken the conversation this way had I not been asked.
@GODOVERYOU - just having a few honest questions. :-)
1) The service works with ~30 sites while RankWYZ works with 100+. --> I'm happy with less than the full blast. I'm sure this list will grow as Jamese & Awint improve their services. It's the core concept I'm trying to understand more.
2) The service (probably) doesn't scrape and combine content, images, videos, insert authority links, etc. RankWYZ does all of that. --> can already be handled by GSA SER using macros and a spinfolder.
3) Does the service let you interlink blogs? RankWYZ lets you interlink your network or networks to create random pattern tiers if you wanted to. --> can already easily be done with macros in GSA SER.
It doesn't feel like you're bashing SER or any of the related services. I'm trying to work out what it is that's missing, since it seems like it's almost there and if @Sven added those 2 features it seems to me that it does what you're talking about - then SER is a crazy powerful tool!
Maybe that's why I'm not fully understanding why you say SER is only a poster and not a builder because it should be able to do the above. (I've been looking for an easy solution for building a set of well maintained properties with multiple posts, content types, and regular updates and it seems SER is the tool for that when those 2 features are added) and if it can be done within SER so much the better.
I've been researching this for a while so appreciating this discussion as trying to find an elegant solution. If you feel your answer will "bash" any of the services, can you rather PM me?
1) The service works with ~30 sites while RankWYZ works with 100+. --> I'm happy with less than the full blast. I'm sure this list will grow as Jamese & Awint improve their services. It's the core concept I'm trying to understand more.
- If you are thinking about using web 2.0's as a 'blast' then you aren't going to understand the difference between the two tools.
That's really the root of the problem....
If you are happy just 'blasting' links, the no blog network tool will be right for you. That's a personal thing, and you can have plenty of success not running a blog network.
When you want to evolve past just blasting links, and develop a network of high PR web properties that you can use to slowly churn out hundreds or thousands self-indexing, drip feed, contextually relevant links from thematically relevant and establish sub-domains then you will probably want a blog management tool.
But if you just want to blast 20-30 links out there every now and then, what you have going on is just fine.
If you don't see the difference between the two principles, then that's exactly the reason you don't see value in tools like FCS or RankWYZ over an 'article blaster' like you already have - or SENuke, Magic Submitter, etc.
We all run our businesses different ways and there's no reason to think I'm talking down about your way. I did the same thing for years. Then I got involved with Link Farm Evolution 3 years ago or so and figured out how beneficial it can be to run a blog farm.
It's really no different that running a blog farm of self-hosted domains. Not everyone does it and truth be told it isn't for everyone the begin with.
Some guys are happy just buying a few dozen blog posts, or a dozen homepage backlinks and leaving it at that. You could also sell posts from a RankWYZ operated blog farm for that matter... but that's a different topic.
Some guys want to control the content on the domains and slowly roll out links from hundreds of sources on what would appear to an algorithm to be more natural sources.
I'm not going to try to convince you of any one strategy. If you have something that works for you then stick with it
I personally prefer to run a hundred blogs from one control panel, pumping both human readable and Content Foundry produced content (with all of the quality features like images, video's, etc) out with legitimate links out to other niche blogs and authority domains - and then sneak some of my links into the mess.
Underneath that would be another much larger network of maybe a thousand blogs producing more auto-generated that is probably much closer to the kind of content you are using in blasts. This thousand blogs or so would be backlinking the hundred blogs to ensure indexing, crawling, and building PR.
But I could never imagine running a huge multi-tier network with that kind of mix of content with an 'article blaster' - whether is be SENuke, Zenno Templates, GSA Templates, Magic Submitter or anything like that.
-=-=- The Gap In Understanding Between Blasting Links And Running A Blog Network Is Specifically Why I Think RankWYZ Is So Misunderstood By Users Who Don't See ANY Value In It. -=-=-
One of the problems I see is that some GSA users are trying to use/make GSA into something it's not or never was initially conceived to be - Mainly posting to the same accounts over and over, TBH it's a real PITA with GSA. That's not it's strength, it has quite a few strengths , so that's good news.
I tried the web 2.0 service for James, I personally didn't care for it, since I had been using FCS networker, and am spoiled by it. I tried creating tiers, but it's too much of a pain with a regular bot, same issue I had with Senuke and MS, takes too long to create lots of tiers, I mean even a basic 10-10 is a pain with any bot, go forbid a 10-100-1000 LOL
I think that what @GODOVERYOU is trying to say could be said as follows:
a) X links from web 2.0 properties with a single or maybe two posts are not as powerful as X links from web 2.0 properties with 10+ posts. Not to mention that a lot of 1-3 posts 2.0 webs are deleted very quickly, so the fix rate with RW and FCS is often higher.
b) RW and FCS have a content generation system.
c) RW and FCS can help you to manage your own private network in a way that would be really hard to achieve for any "first generation web 2.0 poster".
I think that this three points are the main differences and what could make a real difference between first and second generation posters.
By the way, I am using @Jamese SEREngine from the 1st day and I am very happy with it, but it´s a different sort of tool.
@GODOVERYOU - I'm not going for any blasting! Sorry totally bad choice of word. :-) I'm looking at a long term of maintained platforms that last for the long term. No blasting. I understand what you mean that many people want to blast these 1 page single post platforms with a churn and burn strategy.
"I personally prefer to run a hundred blogs from one control panel, pumping both human readable and Content Foundry produced content (with all of the quality features like images, video's, etc) out with legitimate links out to other niche blogs and authority domains - and then sneak some of my links into the mess." - this exactly sums up what I'm trying to achieve. Something that lasts for the next few years.
This is exactly what I'm trying to achieve! Basically have a set of 50 platforms per website that have maybe 300 posts each over a period of 3 years (50weeks x 2 per week x 3 years)
If Sven adds those 2 pts (random scheduled reposting and posting content without links) then surely SER could be used for this? I suppose that was my initial question I wanted to ask.
@AlexR - It's really hard for me to comment on the effectiveness of GSA compared to RankWYZ for running blog networks without actually having all of the tools in my hand to test.
First, you would need all of the scripts for the web 2.0's in your hand for GSA - and getting 100 different web 2.0's written and constantly updated is a lot of work. But assuming you had those, then you would need a system to produce content without you constantly having to feed it to the system.
RankWYZ has news aggregation, which I really love. Not only does it produce human readable content, but it also includes images and most important - links to very well established websites in most cases. Huffington Post is one example I often com across.
In addition, I collect authority links through my own process, which I will do a tutorial on @ SEOSUnite shortly and I include those links in most of my articles - whether they contain links to my site or not.
So you would have to give the GSA scripts the ability to not just generate content, incsert images but also separate different link set and insert those links at random percentages as well.
While on the top of links, you would need GSA to be able to cross-link the blog networks so that you could build not just 1 level tiers, but multilevel tiers and complex link wheels for larger blog network tiers.
Finally you would need GSA to be able to spit out all of the account login details for you anytime you wanted so that you could manually log into the blogs and make any changes you wanted to.
Then we could talk about the two changes you want made.
That a lot of changes just to get GSA to where RankWYZ is now - and mind you - that all hinges on some third party constantly coding and updating 100 scripts for 100 platforms weekly.
So... wow, yeah I suppose if all of those changes were made you could have something similar to the effectiveness of RankWYZ with GSA.
But then again, like I said, I wouldn't be able to make any kind of comparison until I had the final product in my hands to compare the two head-to-head.
My question to you is this: Why are you trying to make an apple an orange? Why not just let GSA build links to the blog network generated by a tool designed to run a blog network?
Is it just a matter of money, because I've got to tell you - I don't think it will be cheap to pay as script writer to write in 100 different blog platforms for GSA and keep them updated constantly. In fact, it might end up costing you jsut as much as RankWYZ's cheaper plans, but then you end up losing an entire copy of GSA just to running a blog network. It doesn't make sense to me.
@Peisithanatos - I appreciate what you are trying to do, but please don't paraphrase my posts because you were suggesting things that I'm not.
For instance, I don't think getting links from blogs with 10 posts is much more valuable than getting links from blogs with 1 post.
Here is what I think:
If you are running an affiliate site that sells skin care products, I think it's better to get links from 20 40-60 page blogs that deal with the science of 'acne vulgaris' as well as links from 10 40-60 page blogs of frustrated teenagers, as well as 20 more from 40-60 page blogs from 10 dermatology students. Then keep dripping more and more from there & begin adding more blogs.
I don't think it's better to get links from any blog that's 10+ pages. There's no relevancy or authority in that.
The real point of RankWYZ is that you can build mini niche authority blogs and get links from them. You can then backlink those mini niche authority blogs with hundred or thousands of other loosely related niche blogs on the topic - and finally blast that lower tier of blogs with tens of thousands of links from GSA.
As far as account availability - I have yet to have a problem getting accounts, but that may have been a problem in the past. I have no way of knowing what happened before I signed up with RankWYZ.
I'm just finding it tricky with all the different tools so was looking if it could be handled within GSA SER.
1) Scripts - handled by James' service. Not quite the 100, but at 30 and growing. I realise this is the risky part. So Rankwyz with 100 is far better here, but I'm happy to start out at 30 to begin with.
2) Content Generation - basically I use a tool for this that just dumps the content into a folder and SER uses a macro to grab a random piece of content without you always having to feed it.
(This is in my process and nearly completed)
It must produce:
a) Fresh content
b) Relevant content
c) Different content types (images, videos, etc)
d) Regular New Content
3) Authority Links - I have been doing this for a while (using a macro). I requested the feature to be incorporated into SER about 4 months ago and it was recently introduced. SER recently introduced a feature that handles this. You can set how many external authority links to use in an article and what authority links to use on each keyword. Maybe a tweak to this feature would be to let it use a random number of external links. I.e. between 0 and 3 or something. Currently it works on a fixed amount.
4) Cross Linking - can be done in part, but would need feature from Sven to allow us to set verified links from different projects. There could be a macro workaround for this in the meantime.
5) Account logins - already can be exported from SER.
I'm not trying to make it fit. I've been researching a process for this for a few months and just figured if SER could handle it, it would be better than using another tool. I've just been continually amazed at what you can do with SER.
You're right though if it's too complicated it might just be easier to use Rankwyz. I just wanted to check that I hadn't missed your logic completely! :-) It seems that if SER adds those 2 features I mentioned it might be able to do what you outlined.
Thanks for taking the time to detail this post. I appreciate it and think that this is an important area to develop in the future.
It's hard for people with one mindset to see a different mindset when it comes in paragraph form.
In order for people to understand what you are doing, they need something visual like the tiered diagrams you, ozz and ron have shown. That is the only way it's going to make sense to the masses.
I've been a rankwyz subscriber since last year and I rarely login... I set up 5 projects in my general niche and let them rip. They have built over 22K successful posts since then, all niche related. So, if I create another site in my niche or if I need some additional links to one of my existing sites, they are sitting there at my disposal.
There is amazing power in that sort of depository of sites/pages/links. Now, you can boost those pages with GSA and/or another Rankwyz tier, you are talking dominant ranking power from high authority domains that are all niche related. The best of both worlds!
In order for people to understand what you are doing, they need something visual like the tiered diagrams you, ozz and ron have shown. That is the only way it's going to make sense to the masses.
Good point!
I'll crack open getpaint.net and do some charts/diagrams for everyone Thanks for the perspective, you are right!
@GODOVERYOU From your 1 year experience using Rankwyz, how many of the 100 platforms can you post successfully? And if things changed, how fast they fixed that?
@Meatplow - Thanks for your insight! Sounds like you're able to automate the content creation. Are you using their built-in scraper or something else to generate posts to your blogs?
@GOY - The aggregation feature is very interesting too. What percentage of syndicated content can be used on these blogs? Are their any general guidelines you recommend when using it?
@audioguy - I'm not sure if there was a misunderstanding along the way but I haven't been using RankWYZ for a year. I did say above that I was using LWB for a year so maybe that was the confusion??
They don't have 100 platforms you can post to. They have 134 or 136 I forget. Right now you can post to 108. They get fixed intermittently, but when you have 108 platforms to play with, you really don't notice the 20 that aren't working all of the time.
It's no different than any other web 2.0 poster - scripts 'break' and then they get fixed.
@gtsurfs - it depends on your niche really. For instance, if you are in the financial niche you will have a lot of news every day so you can use more news aggregated content. But if you are like me and in the penis enlargement niche, there isn't too much news you can use - so I only use it once a week.
I'm still working out the best guidelines for it. I opened a RankWYZ Best Practices Forum on SEOSUnite for those kinds of topics as the topic becomes much more relevant - which it will in short order I'm sure.
Well, I understand the value of blog networks, especially if I can build unlimited amount of them, anytime I want.
I tried a Web 2.0 software service before. Advertised to have 5 dozens, but when I create account... perhaps 40 of them were done successfully. Out of those, let's say 30 were verified via emails. Then during the process of changing themes, deleting default posts, etc., the number decreased again to...let's say 25, to be over optimistic.
Later when adding content: 20. Some of them just post junk because the platform doesn't post image, video, but the software didn't filter it out correctly. Last, when I want to repost, the remaining successful submission became 2-7.
Some were deleted, some no longer accept accounts freely, some no longer in service, etc., most platforms just changed a bit, so the script no longer worked.
I don't know. I agree maintaining that many platforms are extremely hard. Too much work.
It's good to hear that your experience with RankWYZ is nothing but awesome. Just want to clarify and jump in if that is really true, especially when they have news aggregation and other features.
You just listed a lot of the reasons not to use things like SENUke and Magic Submitter when RankWYZ is just as inexpensive & cheaper to run effective networks with.
All of the problems you just listed are reasons people are getting away from first generation posters and on to this second generation.
Above and beyond being able to actually run blogs networks, you avoid all of the account creation problems.
First Generation Problems
That sounds like you were using SENuke or Magic Submitter... while they were great in their time, let's face it - they are article posters. Sure they do a little bookmarking and some other things, but essentially they are built around submitting articles.
Unfortunately, just as you mentioned - they all have to go through a clunky and largely unsuccessful process of get an email account, registering accounts (and only some would work), then verifying accounts (and only some of those would work), and then finally... posting to those accounts and again - only a portion of the total would work.
Second Generation Benefits
With RankWYZ, you are getting accounts that have already been registered and setup. All that's left to do is the posting and only then can you lose SOME of the blogs - but it's a much lower percentage of the total.
When you buy blogs - that means they were already created, setup and ready for you to post on.
Comparison
With something like RankWYZ all of the pre-posting work is already done and accounted for. You aren't getting accounts that can fail email checks, etc. They are ready to go so you aren't getting some obscure percentage like you do with the first generation posters...
That first generation includes posters like GSA, SENuke Xcr, Magic Submitter, SEO Link Robot, or SERobot, etc.
The process you described above isn't a problem with RankWYZ, they solved that
Comments
Now to answer your questions awint, I need to first point out a few things...
Many people on this forum have used both Ozz'es Guide and Ron's Guide with much success! So we know tiered link building works. In addition, we know 'Tiered Content' link building works.
Both of theses guides are based on my principle of content tier'ing as layed out in This Post and This Post. Ozz'es guide gives my posts direct credit, while Ron's guide barrows from Ozz'es guide which inherently means that the concept is borrowed directly from my concepts.
http://seosunite.com/f2/tiered-backlinking-tiered-backlink-building-seo-829/
http://seosunite.com/f2/tiered-link-building-tiered-linking-tutorial-815/
- More links are better than fewer links for competitive niche's
- Content Tiering works
- Indexing is a critical component of link building
- Rank WYZ can run thousands of WEB 2.0 blogs, in tiers!
Additionally:
- 1st generation posters are ineffective at running blog networks of any considerable scale.
- 1st gen posters were designed to fill 30-60 blogs with content, not thousands.
- 1st gen posters need to be constantly monitored for posting and aren't completely automated.
For Reference 1st Generation Posters Are:
Senuke, Magic Submitter, SEO Link Robot, SERobot, etc.
2nd Generation Posters Are:
Link Wheel Bandit, FCS Networker, RankWYZ
The difference between the posters is volume and automation. The scale of use in the 2nd generation of posters simply can't be matched by their 1st generation counterparts.
Why Is This Important?
When you look at my posts, you will find that running tier's is mostly about scaling operations. The larger the scale of the operation, the more successful the linking campaign will be. We could stop right there and confirm RankWYZ as the best tool for that since it can operate on the largest scale out of all of the tools considered, but let's look at some examples.
Tiered Linking
I will barrow images from my posts to get the point across...
http://img4.imageshack.us/img4/9173/71363990.png
While any poster can create just a few tier's of links, not all posters can leverage the power of large networks of tiered links. The above image represents what RankWYZ can do, but also what SENuke and other first generation posters can do.
However, what first generation posters can't do is shown below:
http://img191.imageshack.us/img191/58/40663079.png
With RankWYZ you can run much larger, more powerful networks which making your link building efforts much more meaningful and gives your work much greater impact on the actual SERPS.
Besides Basic Link Building
Once you have many networks of several hundred blogs you can also build one specific network of blogs purely meant to do other things - such as indexing your backlinks.
While tools like RankWYZ and GSa are both great, they are only as effective as their indexed backlinks....
An easy way to solve this problem is to maintain a network of regularly crawled web 2.0's and post links to the links you need to get index from it.
In other words, RankWYZ gives you a completely automated indexing machine as well as a link building web 2.0 based network.
Hopefully I've illustrated why the second generation of posters are much more powerful than their first generation counterparts. RankWYZ is one of several of the second generation, but having used both link wheel bandit and FCS networker - it's a hands down win for RankWYZ because of how easily you can scale your operation from not just hundreds of blogs, but up to thousands of blogs with RankWYZ.
*I'm not paid to make these statements, and I've been involved in BH SEO for years. My opinions are based on my experience with all of the tools listed and their practical application and limits as the developers have designed them.*
- LOL, no not a partner. But I am a happy user, so when I read this thread I felt compelled to correct a lot of the bad information and misunderstanding in it. When you release your tool, if I use it and think highly of it, I'd probably do the same for it if people bashed it over silly things, like 5000 posts per day.
- Have you ever run a large blog network on satellite properties before? Maybe not with WEB 2.0, but something like WPMU or anything like that?
If you haven't, then let me explain a few things...
You can't post to each one every day. If you do, they will be quickly banned and lost. When they get banned, all of the links that you've build to them are worthless. So basically, if you think you need to post once or '100's' of times each day to each blog then you are going to be wasting a lot of time.
You will be wasting time not just building the blogs, but building links to the blogs.
>>> Because of that you DO NOT want to post every day to every blog <<<
Now that's different than the gen 1 posters because they weren't built to run networks, they were built to post articles.
I don't think you understand the difference between a web 2.0's tool that just posts articles and a web 2.0 tool that runs networks. It's a big difference!
When you are just posting articles, then it makes sense to post to those accounts as often as possible because it doesn't matter if they get banned.
When you are running a network, you want to avoid the accounts from getting banned. That goes for LWB, FCS, or RankWYZ.
To be honest, you aren't alone. When I read the replies that were above this, it was clear that most newbs didn't see the difference between running a network and just posting some articles.
-=- If you don't want to run a network or don't understand why you would want to run a network then FCS, LWB and RankWYZ really aren't for you. -=-
At most your blogs shouldn't be posted to more than 2-3 times a week! So if you are posting to yoru blgos 2-3 times a week, let's say it's once every 3 days.
- There's 30 days in a month, that's 10 posts per month you will want to be making per blog.
- You can post 5000 times per day on my account, so that's 150,000 posts per month that you can make.
150,000 posts divided by 10 posts per blog = *15,000 Blogs You Can Run!*
So no, I think $400 a month is a fair price to run 15,000 web 2.0 accounts a month. If you don't think you can build any links from 15,000 blog accounts every month then I think you are in the wrong business
So, how do you index links with 'Just' 5000 posts a day? That's also really silly to suggest you can't.
There's no rule saying that you can put 20 links into an post. It's actually very common practice with a lot of these 'Index services.'
So, 20 links x 5000 posts a day = 100,000 links per day that you could be trying to get indexed.
- When you look at the math, are you beginning to see why it's silly of you to think that 5000 posts per day is a limiting factor?
but with FCS and LWB, you can run unlimited indeed. there is only machine/server limit.
You are wrong here.
- With FCS it's 15,000 to 30,000 a month - NOT a 'machine limit.'
- With LWB, have you ever used it? It's not a machine limit - you are limited by the number of times it crashes. It constantly needed to be restarted, but all that time that it was hun up - it wasn't posting!
So on that point you are completely inaccurate.
I have not use rankwyz so ONLY I can guess is Rankwyz can do huge scale with a very easy way that mean COMPLETELY automatically, but with much more cost. Am I right?
If you haven't used it then why are you making assumptions?
And $98 a month for a more 'affordable' plan is still much cheaper than $147 a month for SENuke. The difference is that you will still be able to run far more blogs on the $98 plan than you could with all 3 installs of SENuke.
So here again, you are incorrect in your assumption on price to performance.
What is drop rate when you use Rankwyz. It is very important. With LWB there is a auto heal. with FCS, you can "heal" manually for free. but can Rankwyz compensate blogs account for free if got deleted or you must will buy again? if stick rate is high, that is not important.
Above we talked about not posting to the blogs too frequently. That helps with the stick rate incredibly.
Using my posting strategy, I've only lost about 30 blogs out of 1000. That's 3%. But that's my case. I'd say 10% is more reasonable, and anything above 10% is too high.
If you lose blogs, you do have to either create them yourself, or buy them - BUT - once a month you get a bunch of free blogs depending on which plan you are on. The $98 plan gives you 80 free blogs a month if I recall correctly, so more than enough to replace the banned blogs.
Well, it should be more than enough... if you post with it like it wasn't meant to run a network, then you might need more but really that your own user error, not the fault of the system.
As far as LWB's auto heal system, we know you haven't used RankWYZ but have you used LWB? The auto-heal virtually never worked as planned. It was hung up, crash, etc and not 'fix links' in posts already on the other blogs.
In addition, LWB only actually support 15-20 properties, while RankWYZ currently supports over 100.
With RankWYZ, you are notified in your user panel when blogs are suspended and it literally takes less than 60 seconds to replace them with new blogs.
So In Conclusion -
There's some misunderstandings you had about RankWYZ. Hopefully we got those corrected.
RankWYZ isn't the perfect tool but it is much better than most other tools on the market and it's one I believe in.
-=-=- But In order to get any value out of it you have to understand the difference between an article poster and a blog network -=-=-
I look forward to your tool awint
a) X links from web 2.0 properties with a single or maybe two posts are not as powerful as X links from web 2.0 properties with 10+ posts. Not to mention that a lot of 1-3 posts 2.0 webs are deleted very quickly, so the fix rate with RW and FCS is often higher.
b) RW and FCS have a content generation system.
c) RW and FCS can help you to manage your own private network in a way that would be really hard to achieve for any "first generation web 2.0 poster".
I think that this three points are the main differences and what could make a real difference between first and second generation posters.
By the way, I am using @Jamese SEREngine from the 1st day and I am very happy with it, but it´s a different sort of tool.
Another part of the interview caught my attention. Wehyer said this statement…
“Relevance is the new PR.”
http://site-reference.com/articles/former-google-search-quality-team-member-reveals-all/
As far as account availability - I have yet to have a problem getting accounts, but that may have been a problem in the past. I have no way of knowing what happened before I signed up with RankWYZ.
Take care guys - have a good Sunday evening
It's hard for people with one mindset to see a different mindset when it comes in paragraph form.
In order for people to understand what you are doing, they need something visual like the tiered diagrams you, ozz and ron have shown. That is the only way it's going to make sense to the masses.
I've been a rankwyz subscriber since last year and I rarely login... I set up 5 projects in my general niche and let them rip. They have built over 22K successful posts since then, all niche related. So, if I create another site in my niche or if I need some additional links to one of my existing sites, they are sitting there at my disposal.
There is amazing power in that sort of depository of sites/pages/links. Now, you can boost those pages with GSA and/or another Rankwyz tier, you are talking dominant ranking power from high authority domains that are all niche related. The best of both worlds!
@GOY - The aggregation feature is very interesting too. What percentage of syndicated content can be used on these blogs? Are their any general guidelines you recommend when using it?