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Matt Cutts recent video about tiered linking

I wondered if anyone was slightly worried about the "Penguin 2.0" update that Cutts posted yesterday.

Seems to be talking about tiered linking. Should we be worried?  :)  Do you have any plans to mitigate risk ? Or just ride it and see? My own analysis of it is, they are going to see which domains/networks provide link spam on lower tiers then demote/penalize any links found. Could be wrong though.


  • AlexRAlexR Cape Town
    Did he actually say anything specific in that whole video? It sounded like "hey, we're working on our algorithm like we always do..." 
  • He says something about going "upstream to deny the value to link spammers" as well as something about "more sophisticated link analysis"

    Both of which could mean anything :D
  • spunko2010spunko2010 Isle of Man
    edited May 2013
    Well he refers to spamming upstream links around 3:00. After referring to payday loans, which famously use tiered links for their SERPS.

    Of course he's as vague as ever. But that does at least sound like tiered linking is on their radar, no?
  • Couldn't understand a word of it, then again i don't speak twat
  • > payday loans

    He was specifically referring to serps, which are overrun by sites relying on hacked sites for links.
  • Bring it on! More scaremongering = less fish in my pond :)
  • AlexRAlexR Cape Town
    If Matt is not aware of tiered link building he'd not be working for Google. I think they have know about it for's just a question if they have the computing power to handle the permutations and if it's financially viable to focus on. 
  • Cutts' recent tweet: "Pretty much every SEO should watch this video:  (unless you prefer surprises)"

    Cue scary Muwahahahahaha and lightning flashes
  • Well, I survived every animal G threw at me and I'm still here winning on page 1
  • They just love this, don´t they? Do make a video every now and then scaring people away from the things that actually work. They don´t really have all the tools to compat all this spam so they make videos like that to scare people away, and its working - which is kind of great for the rest of us.
  • I am soooooo excited. I know I can't be the only one. 
  • edited May 2013
    "which famously use tiered links for their SERPS. "

    Payday serps have a lot more going on, it's not really tiers that are doing it.  Like someone else said the top guys are using hacked stuff which has been what's making the rounds on blogs complaining.
  • spunko2010spunko2010 Isle of Man
    edited May 2013
    Oh, I am excited. But apprehensive. As I haven't ever had to 'endure' a Google update before. Well, not one where it affected my income anyway. But nobody here seems that bothered, so, guess I will stop worrying :)@seagul do you mean the same URLs survived? Or are you a churn and burn type person.

  • The Payday thing was through a hacked plugin on drupal blogs if I am not mistaken, which goes to show what can be done through mass-spam campaigns. If it did not work, Google would not try to prevent it, take networks down, come out with endless updates etc. 

    Until I see them actually come out with something that works, and by that I mean actually works - knows quality content, can tell whats spam and whats not, can see through complicated tiered stuff etc. - I will not be taking vidoes like that to seriously :D
  • Nice t-shirt.
  • edited May 2013
    @Spunko2010 What I meant by my comment is that I adapted and triumphed while a lot of others gave up. Now enough fun. Time to get back to work ;)
  • Why would he warn seo's ? If they could do it they would. Seems like their propaganda is just as powerful as their algo.
  • I am now selling amazon kindle ebooks as a new income stream.
  • ronron
    edited May 2013

    By the way, Jim, the moderator on GOY's forum SEOSUnite wrote up an excellent summary of Cutt's video at:

    Quite honestly, about going upstream, I could easily envision a very simple algo that could catch tiers, and I'm not going to say it out loud here. Then again, they have every PhD on their team from Asia, so I'm sure they have something cooked up on that.

    What I found interesting was the circuitous admission that PR matters, else they wouldn't be going after paid links and advertorials with high PR. You don't go after something if it doesn't matter.

    Again, this is a situation where if you build a worthwhile site, and you invest a respectable effort to provide visitors a good experience, and you have a diverse base of links, you should be just fine. 

  • @ron

    I have a different interpretation about going upstream. A lot of people are relying on web 2.0s and the like because of the massive shift in how root domain authority flowed after last penguin. Most (or at least a lot) of SEOs are using web 2.0s as their buffers or first tier sites. Why not stop them right there? If they devalue how the algo rewards root domain authority on newly created sub-domains, they could effectively do a lot of damage. 
  • ronron
    edited May 2013

    I actually agree with your statement, but I also can easily see how it can be applied even a few levels further down, and across any platform. In fact, I don't even think the platform matters. I don't really want to say more because this is where public forums will hang every one of us. It should be self-evident.

  • spunko2010spunko2010 Isle of Man
    Ron, I'd be interested in hearing via PM what you have in mind regards to catching upward tiers. I have built mostly web2.0 links to my MS. Of course, it's risky strategy to change that now anyway, maybe that's what Fatt Cu*ts had in mind by posting this vid? :)
  • Amusing how much BS a dumb video can start.
  • davbeldavbel UK
    edited May 2013
    What @seagul says ^^^

    It happens every time and is mostly whipped up by all the well known "SEO Experts" that all get a bit carried away with themselves on their's all just propaganda :D

  • edited May 2013

    "blahahahaha....... lies lies lies......." thats all i hear in these videos

    Oh well just like all the other updates this wont effect me in the slightest.....actually imrpove my rankings  long term:D
  • Matt was hired by G to make a lot of noise but that's all it is. G made $50billion last year do you think they give a rats ass what you're doing?
  • edited May 2013
    For those that have not seen this video, its a must see and gives a pritty conclusive insight into how Google plans on getting those "tiers". It also goes to show how powerfull the algo is :D
  • spunko2010spunko2010 Isle of Man
    edited May 2013
    OK. So no effect expected then.... Guess we can resume this thread (maybe) in a few months (if) there is such a thing as Penguin 2.0. :D

    (@seagul Personally, I do think that Google would care about potentially millions of sites manipulating their results which takes away from the so-called UX and thus affects their bottom line if people don't trust their results as much. I think it comes down to, as another said, if they can detect it, I asked ron for clarification but maybe he wasn't interested in sharing. Guess we shall just wait and see)
  • ronron

    I've been busy. I sort of agree with those that have the attitude...'here we go again, more disinformation to scare and rattle the troops'. For sure Matt is full of crap most of the time. The guy should be in politics. But Panda wasn't full of crap. And neither was Penguin. Occasionally the goons in mountain view come up with something that flips the apple cart upside down - usually once a year - and we are about due. 

    Look, they have all links in the universe. Google = All Links In The Universe. Majestic only has some. Ahrefs only has some. When you have the universe, you have total knowledge in one database. A fifth grader could write an algo that looks at when your links were built, and when links linking to those links (upstream) were built. This does not require a PhD from India.

    The problem that always arises when they write an algo is that good, clean, choirboy sites get whacked. They really don't want that. So they have a big ass computer that parallels the stuff the public has, and they look at what happens to the serp database - with a new algo - to the best of their ability. This is how you would test anything with a big ass database. You copy the real database offline, and perform your testing.

    There is nothing that Matt says that will change my behavior or anyone else that is serious about making a living in this industry. But if you don't think that it is incredibly easy to hunt down tiered linkbuilding or other stuff, you have a vacuous space between your ears.

    The issue is what can you do about it - in a continuous manner - to minimize or negate the effects when an algo hits. Hint: Diversity of link building approaches and sources. Will you get whacked over the head like many did when Penguin hit, and leave the business? Or will you smarten up and actually do things to lessen the chance of damage?

    Who knows if it is just another disinformation video. It didn't scare me. But it did remind me that a big flip of the apple cart is overdue. And I honestly believe this time it will be something new. Not a lame part 2,3,4 of a previous algo. I believe it will be a completely new algo, just like penguin was completely different than panda.

  • Thanks Ron for your comments on this. Given this new update coming soon what is your current stance on your tiered diagram that many are using?
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